1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Undead Advice on Undead team development

Discussion in 'League and Team Development Tactics' started by Ronocnz, Jul 22, 2019.

  1. Ronocnz

    Ronocnz New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Steam Username:
    Ronocnz
    Country Flag:
    Hey guys,

    Been playing blood bowl for about a month now in a local league and we are just redrafting for next season.

    I have enough money to redraft my current team of 12 players including 3 rerolls with 140k to spare.

    My question is, would it be better to spend the 140k on 2 ghouls (to give me the maximum allowed of 4) or on a reroll and a ghoul (giving me 4 rerolls and 3 ghouls)?

    Any help much appreciated!
     
  2. sbr32

    sbr32 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,035
    Location:
    US West Coast (GMT-8)
    Cyanide Username:
    sbr32
    Country Flag:
    Undead, and most other "normal"* teams, should not need more than 3 rerolls. If you are regularly needing more you need to examine your play style and what rolls you are rerolling.

    That said I don't know how many Undead coaches run with all 4 Ghouls. It seems like a lot to me but I haven't played Undead seriously at all.

    *Exceptions: Vampires, Kislev/Slann, Ogres? Maybe some others?

    EDIT: And Welcome!
     
  3. Supa

    Supa Active Member

    Messages:
    451
    Location:
    Finland
    Steam Username:
    Supa
    Cyanide Username:
    Supajee
    Country Flag:
    Welcome to the forums! You should be fine with 3 rerolls. I'd only consider 4th RR for playoffs with overtime implemented (and even that could be too expensive). 3 ghouls is usually the optimal amount in no po-environment in my opinion.

    So you could buy a zombie (or skeleton) instead of a 4th ghoul, also banking some gold just in case, while staying at 3 rerolls.
     
    Halub and sbr32 like this.
  4. Ronocnz

    Ronocnz New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Steam Username:
    Ronocnz
    Country Flag:
    Thanks for the welcome!! The reasoning behind having 4 ghouls would be to have 3 on the pitch and one in reserve for when they inevitably get injured or killed. I already have a spare zombie from a necromancer earlier in the season so I could buy a 3rd skeleton maybe but that just seems like adding players just for the sake of it?
     
  5. Ronocnz

    Ronocnz New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Steam Username:
    Ronocnz
    Country Flag:
    Thanks for the welcome and the reply! Would it be worth putting money into fan factor or coaches/cheerleaders instead?
     
  6. cjblackburn

    cjblackburn Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    5,403
    Location:
    Stockport
    Cyanide Username:
    cjblackburn
    Country Flag:
    In part it depends on the skills that the Ghouls have and the type of competition you are in. I would probably aim for 4 ghouls but start by getting a third, get block or wrestle on it then get the forth one.

    Since you mentioned redrafting I assume this is tabletop 2016 BB. In this format you don’t need to keep TV as low in most leagues. So having a blodge sure hands ghoul sit out your defence isn’t too bad and still having a couple of ghouls after u lose a couple is better than being down to one. If this was online tv based matchmaking then three is probably best but if I am right then getting to 4 ghouls makes sense.
     
  7. Supa

    Supa Active Member

    Messages:
    451
    Location:
    Finland
    Steam Username:
    Supa
    Cyanide Username:
    Supajee
    Country Flag:
    Generally spending money on fan factor and assistant coaches/cheerleaders is bad business for league play.

    Yes eventually a 4th ghoul makes an entrance most likely. I wouldn't sleep on bribe(s) though, that extra cost of 30k from ghoul might make a difference. It's mainly a preference for me to run with 2-3 ghouls (depending if it's CRP or BB2016) to keep TV a bit down and to not have so many valuable pieces on the pitch to protect.
     
  8. tys123

    tys123 Courier Staff

    Messages:
    2,857
    Country Flag:
    I prefer 4 ghouls. Yes you can't protect them all but a SH one can sit on the bench when on defence and I prefer the extra mobility.
    Also more ghouls = more chance of rolling a double or stat on one of them.
    IMO more ghouls gives you a better chance of winning the next game.

    It also depends on the skill levels of the players involved.
    The better your opponent the more likely you are to be stuck out of position and need the speed to recover.
    The better you are the more likely your zombies will be in the right place so you don't need as many fast players.
     
  9. cjblackburn

    cjblackburn Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    5,403
    Location:
    Stockport
    Cyanide Username:
    cjblackburn
    Country Flag:
    I like 20 Ghouls.
     
    Halub likes this.
  10. Halub

    Halub Active Member

    Messages:
    211
    Steam Username:
    halub
    Country Flag:
    Would an all ghouls team play like worse or better Amazons??
     
  11. Halub

    Halub Active Member

    Messages:
    211
    Steam Username:
    halub
    Country Flag:
    I agree with @Supa here - I'd go with 3 ghouls and a skelly for that extra fouling power and movement while keeping your TV low. It's true that skeletons are just as squishy as ghouls with AV 7 but they have thick skull and - most importantly - regen!

    Edit: come to think of it skeletons are probably more on the crunchy side if you know what I mean
     
  12. cjblackburn

    cjblackburn Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    5,403
    Location:
    Stockport
    Cyanide Username:
    cjblackburn
    Country Flag:
    But why are you keeping your TV low in a small local tabletop league? Inducements are good but I’d rather have it in my team.

    Rono as you can perhaps tell BB doesn’t have one set meta due to the many different types of competitions so do what you fancy and learn from that. There are very few players you don’t want in your team given the option so just experiment with what suits you.
     
    sbr32 likes this.
  13. Halub

    Halub Active Member

    Messages:
    211
    Steam Username:
    halub
    Country Flag:
    That's a good point and I don't have any experience with that format. However having access to a bribe most of the time to allow for even more excessive fouling would be nice, wouldn't it?
     
  14. cjblackburn

    cjblackburn Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    5,403
    Location:
    Stockport
    Cyanide Username:
    cjblackburn
    Country Flag:
    The problem is taking a skeleton over a ghoul only saves you 30k. I’m not saying go straight for 4 ghouls especially if there is a matchup where a inducements are important and 30k makes the difference but in general you want to top out at 4 ghouls. Also bribes are great but I tend not to bother till I have a dirty player and in bb2016 I don’t see a zombie or skeleton getting anywhere near a mvp in the first 10 matches. I’d rather have skills on mummies and wrights so dirty player isn’t that likely.
     
  15. BallztotheWalla

    BallztotheWalla Active Member

    Messages:
    214
    Country Flag:
    IMO you get the 4th ghoul as soon as the 3 you start with got block or wrestle. Until the 4th ghoul lvl’s you don’t have to Protect it to much since you can just buy another if it gets hurts and +3ma +1ag and dodge for 30 tv is a pretty good deal
     
  16. Supa

    Supa Active Member

    Messages:
    451
    Location:
    Finland
    Steam Username:
    Supa
    Cyanide Username:
    Supajee
    Country Flag:
    Good thing to keep in mind is that ghouls are mainly expendable tools after all, since they have no longevity due to their squishiness and lack of regeneration. They're quite bad players without block or wrestle. Thus the main thing to consider is that is 4th (or even 3rd) ghoul going to affect negatively on your performance on the pitch. Especially at lower team values Undead are one of the better bash teams thanks to mummies and block access on wights, cheap scrubs and regeneration. So they can get away by decreasing their mobility simply because they can outbash their opposition, outnumbering them. Skilless ghoul is a prime target for opponent's blitzes, and Undead really would like to outnumber their opponents at this stage.

    As other teams get better skills zombies are starting to feel really awkward to field and generally Undead teams tend to be on the lower side on the team value, so ghouls start to be more impactful later on especially if skilled, and are neat against kill teams with little tackle.

    Back to my original point:
    Depends, depends, depends.

    Didn't expect this to raise so much discussion. :D I believe that everyone's saying the same thing, just implementing it differently. :) What I could've said on my first post is that fielding 3 ghouls is usually the optimal amount.
     
    Halub likes this.
  17. danton

    danton Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,551
    Location:
    Buenos Aires (gmt -3)
    Cyanide Username:
    danton
    Country Flag:
    Go with 3 ghouls to start with, but add a 4th when the other three all have Block / Wrestle. Developed Undead teams need 4 ghouls in my experience.
     
  18. Ronocnz

    Ronocnz New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Steam Username:
    Ronocnz
    Country Flag:
    Hey guys thanks for all the replies! I had a good time reading through them and seeing the pros and cons of the different sides. I've decided to go with 4 ghouls instead of splashing for an extra reroll. Judging by the advice though I will only field 3 at a time, keeping one with sure hands and blodge for offense only. Our league ran this weird training camp random event so one of the new ghouls will start with sure hands which means I think I will develop him along that path first.