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Blood Bowl II Screenshots + News

Discussion in 'Blood Bowl 2' started by Coach, Oct 10, 2013.

  1. Jav

    Jav Active Member

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    GW should be more focused on giving the customers what they want and absorbing the FUMMBL players so they can make more money. A slann BB team does not break their other games...
     
  2. Gallows Bait

    Gallows Bait Super Moderator Moderator

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    Cease and Desist order would cover that, I don't see a need to compete with it. ;)

    That said, I am one of the many disenfranchised by their focus on core games and following the money trail, but I can hardly blame them, they're a commercial business after all.

    In effect, making big plastic tank kits is giving the largest number of their customers exactly what they do want, it just means they don't bother with the little stuff.
     
  3. Jav

    Jav Active Member

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    But why actively block the other things? It would take less effort!
     
  4. Gallows Bait

    Gallows Bait Super Moderator Moderator

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    Actively blocking things is the only means of proving that you are keeping control of your IP and that therefore others don't really have a right to take it off you. If you neglect your IP its much harder to act when someone steals it as you left it unattended for so long, if you see what I mean.
     
  5. Narly Bird

    Narly Bird Well-Known Member

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    Whilst i agree with what you say about I.P. GB, it does make me wonder why they haven't taken any steps against FUMBL?

    Regarding them focusing on core games, it is a disappointment. But in one sense they do seem to have relaxed a bit and that is in terms of selling rights to PC games. If Bloodbowl (TT) was still very popular and one of their core games, i can't see BB ever coming out on PC. +1 for Space Hulk and +1 next year for Armageddon. So whilst you aren't getting it on TT format, at least you get it for PC. And for me personally, i prefer to receive it in PC format for multiple reasons (a. much cheaper than buying all the mini’s, b. i live in a country where nobody plays these games, c. i have very little free time, d. I suck at painting). One can argue about the quality of the PC game compared to the originals, but I think its still a positive that they don’t just lock their discontinued stuff away, burn it and then bury it in a hole.

    I’m really hanging for Armageddon, but I will also be getting BB2 whether or not it has Slann. Whilst Slann would add an interesting element to the game, I would like to see some new teams (such as the other Chaos gods, Bretonian, etc.).
     
  6. Gallows Bait

    Gallows Bait Super Moderator Moderator

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    I think Fumbbl has done, for the most part, enough to avoid the direct and blatant infringement aspects that GW normally go after most actively - artwork, brand names, rules printing and so forth.

    There is also the aspect that they're not directly attempting to make any money out of it, so much as encourage people to play the game for the love of the game.

    I do also think there is merit to the often touted argument that Fumbbl has helped keep the community alive, including a large number of tabletop players, which may have in part shielded them.

    I don't buy some of the arguments people make about GW's failure to act being de facto consent for Fumbbl to continue, after all the lack of action does not signal a licence by any means, and thus they do survive very much by hoping to remain in GW's seemingly deliberate blind spot, rather than by any sort of right.

    I am surprised that with the Cyanide licence they didn't act to prevent competition, but perhaps they decided that closing fumbbl would not have had much impact on Cyanide's sales, or perhaps even a negative impact by leaving the community less active. I am curious to be honest, but I doubt we'll ever know.
     
  7. nufflehatesme

    nufflehatesme Member

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    you need a copy of the rules to play on fumbbl. GW provides the rules for free. no case to answer. much like playing scrabble or monopoly over your phone on a 3rd party app as far as I understand.

    GW did come down on fumbbl pretty hard just before cyanide released blood bowl. letters were sent. fumbbl had to remove all of GW art, as well as change the client name from bloodbowl client to fantasy football client. more a protection of IP I think then a cease and desist.
    go digging on fumbbl forums and you will find a lot more about it. I am only going from memory here :) pretty sure the letter from GW is on the forums somewhere.
     
  8. Darkson

    Darkson Member

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    None of those arguments hold up though, given that TFF did all the above, without having a playable version of the game, and that got hit by a C&D.

    I think it was mainly because Christer got someone with a legal background to actually read and reply to GW's letter. GW Legal dept sends out a lot more C&Ds than they actually have a right to, but because most recipients don't have the money/contacts to contest them they give way.

    When someone does stand up to them (Chapterhouse, trying to get a old book called Space Marine removed from Amazon) GW gets shown to be wrong on so many things...
     
  9. Gallows Bait

    Gallows Bait Super Moderator Moderator

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    Actually the Scrabble thing is an interesting point. You don't need a copy of the rules to play (just like you don't for Fumbbl, you just won't understand it as well if you don't but claiming you need the rules is still unfortunately a BS argument in terms of the law, what matters if IP, which game mechanics often aren't covered as well by, but creative areas such as races, backgrounds, names are well covered), but the people that made versions that did blatantly impinge on the IP did get sued over their Facebook games etc.

    Similarly the blatant use of their IP such as logos, names etc tends to get heaviest hit. As Darkson notes, Cease & Desist is the quick and easy way, and where people understand and act, it does resolve a lot of the problems GW have with those parties.

    But when it gets more complicated than "stop using our logos/copyright images" etc, then it does need legal work to step up to a costly level. With FUMBBL I suspect the biggest factor is simply that they're not profiting off it and also the fact that by making the rules free online they're hard pushed to prove it is either allowing someone else to profit from their product or that it's detrimental to their own sales.

    That said, Focus/Cyanide would have a much better legal case for this, since it impinges the licence they have been given and stretching that licencing fee income link to their own pocket would be GW's best tactic if they did try to pursue it, from my understanding, but it's probably not economical.

    As to the mentioned Chapterhouse incident, its important to note a few key points in that decision.

    a) GW got kicked because they tried to claim IP rights where they had none. Space Marine, for example, is a generic term used long before GW made them. In a lot of cases they tried to claim everything right down to the kitchen sink as theirs exclusively. Rightly they were slapped for this, it's bullying and not what the law is supposed to be for.

    b) GW failed to get a result in areas where things are considered "compatible" but not marketed AS the GW product. For alternative BB miniature manufacturers this is a key point - if you make something that CAN be used alongside a GW product, that's fine. If you market is AS a GW product or something they have the IP for then you would rightly be impinging the IP.

    c) GW won on the blatant abuse of IP that Chapterhouse were guilty of, which is important for them to protect that IP and prevent people from heading down the lines of blatantly ripping them off with copies, duplicate casts, 3D prints of their range or where people claim them to be what they're not.

    Regarding TFF, I must admit I don't know the history, but I'd hazard a guess that GW were probably bullying to a degree, but I couldn't comment exactly without knowing whether their was any art, names etc in use (similarly this very site also changed name to avoid issues - Blood Bowl is after all a propriatory term).

    As I've commented elsewhere, I think the only area I could see FUMBBL specifically picked up would be if the client used copyright terms or specifically quoted from the published rules (the quoting of publications is very well covered in law by my understanding, that's why there's a poster setting out the law by every photocopier in any school or university). The game mechanics being coded into the client are much harder to protect in law.
     
  10. SorroW

    SorroW Member

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  11. danton

    danton Well-Known Member

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    Looks nice!
     
  12. Barristan

    Barristan Member

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    It does. And yet I'm not sold on the icons to replace the skills names. Seems harder to have a quick glance at a player's abilities, although I guess with habit it would come.
     
  13. Ken

    Ken Kenny the Mechanic

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    Assuming skills are colour coded by type, i see: block, mighty blow, kick?, guard, pile on, frenzy (pink-eye)

    and the Stat up (he's ST 4) is not listed in the skill section at all. can't say I'm a huge fan of there not being a list, it'll probably be a selectable layout though.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2014
  14. Nikolai II

    Nikolai II Super Moderator Moderator

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    And I see Fend, Mighty Blow, Dirty Player, Block, Piling On and why not Pass Block.

    But sure, your colour coding suggestion makes sense and makes it possible this could be learned after a while or five.

    I'd still prefer a list, or at least subtitles without having to mouseover :p
     
  15. Phunbaba

    Phunbaba Active Member

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    I see age listed, I wonder if that's just for fun facts or if that will be bringing back aging rules. Maybe it'd be optional if they do.
     
  16. TravelScrabble

    TravelScrabble Well-Known Member

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    I like this game. My guess is block, Mb, dp, guard, po, frenzy?
     
  17. TravelScrabble

    TravelScrabble Well-Known Member

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    So like Ken :) Frenzy one is weird though I'm changing my guess to leader why not
     
  18. Nikolai II

    Nikolai II Super Moderator Moderator

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    They used aging rules in their blitz version of the rules, so why not.
     
  19. Remthar

    Remthar Well-Known Member

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    Looks quite nice.
     
  20. Ken

    Ken Kenny the Mechanic

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    If nothing else it looks like quite a bit of effort is going into this