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Amazon CCL Amazons development

Discussion in 'League and Team Development Tactics' started by patbou73, Jul 23, 2020.

  1. patbou73

    patbou73 Active Member

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    I’m new to Amazons. So far 2-1-0 in CCL (including a 1-0 victory against Chaos Dwarves). This is my team :
    4 Blitzers
    2 Catchers (one has Block)
    6 Linemen (one has Wrestle)
    3 Rerolls
    1 Apo
    160k gold in bank

    No casualties so far. How should I spend my gold? The plasmoid playbook says 14-15 players and 5-6 RRs. Isn’t it a bit much? Should I buy Throwers now? Or wait to replace injured linemen? Maybe upgrade the Stadium? I’ve seen successful Amazon teams with the star player 50k discount (maybe to buy chainsaw), or the protection vs Thrown Rock and Pitch Invasion... which one?

    Also, I would like to get some advices on how to get 2-1. I usually get 1-0 by successfully defending and scoring on my drive, but that’s it...
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2020
  2. tys123

    tys123 Courier Staff

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    In CCL I would stick to 13 players and just linemen and blitzers.
    You don't plan to pass or catch the ball so +20 to the TV for a skill you don't want to use is a waste.
    I would take the security gate to stop riots. It is tough to score in 2 turns with zons so the clock going back on turn 8/16 doesn't benefit you much when receiving but causes problems when kicking.
     
  3. BallztotheWalla

    BallztotheWalla Active Member

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    what tys123 said + no team should ever have more than 3 rr (vamps excluded) and in ccl even 3 rr is pushing it. Zons in ccl is all about keeping tv low to cheese their broken starting roster and try to avoid the 1500 tv 10 guard/mb dwarf teams that some idiot farmed by playing 30 matches in 12 hours after reset.
     
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  4. patbou73

    patbou73 Active Member

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    I think, because replacements are cheap, Amazons will have cash to spend on inducements every 2 or 3 games. It is then either Babes for 50k or Helmut Wulf for 60k if you have Nuffle Altar stadium upgrade. It’s probably the reason why the top Amazon teams have this upgrade instead of riot or rock protection.
     
  5. patbou73

    patbou73 Active Member

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    Other than a prayer and a sacrifice to Nuffle, what’s the Amazons’ strategy against Dwarves?

    At one point I made the mistake of basing 2 units, giving opposition that many free blocks. I wanted to help out a Lino that was based. What was the right play? Keep her there to take a free block (25% of staying up)? Dodge her out (67%)? Make a -2D unskilled block (44% to succeed) and still take a 2D block next turn? I know we’re not supposed to roll unnecessary dice, but it seems to me that I should have just risked hitting the grass on a failed dodge, than doing anything else (most particularly sending assist), and just suffering a blitz next turn...

    I’m wondering if that 12th player is hurting me or helping me. I got 50k inducements (Babes), and I have 50k Lino on the bench. Opponent had 5 skills for that value (about 7-8 Guards total, and one MB Blitzer, plus Blodge Runner). Maybe the matchmaking system would have paired me with a more suitable opponent if I didn’t had so many players...
     
  6. BallztotheWalla

    BallztotheWalla Active Member

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    1.dont play ccl But if you do Fouling and/or being unpleasant in chat, lightning bolt his best player and alt+4 are all valid plays against dorfs or teams with a higher tv.

    2. you should take the dodge

    3. Amazon needs a bench and there is nothing you can really do against the mm it’s deliberately made by morons to match you up against teams 500 tv better than yours.
    The only play is to not play see answer 1
     
  7. tys123

    tys123 Courier Staff

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    When you get enough guard you can block most of the dwarves away when they move up to mark you.
    But when that isn't an option dodging away is better than taking the hit.
    If that 50K in inducements had been guard on 3 of your blitzers instead you would have had more of a chance.

    If you meet a dwarf team when you only have 11 players you are going to be in trouble so dumping the bench is a bad idea.
     
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  8. patbou73

    patbou73 Active Member

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    alt+4?
     
  9. patbou73

    patbou73 Active Member

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    Amazons vs Khemri. Underdog, got Wizard, Helmut and Babes. Scored on turn 8, thanks to Fireball. Now is offense, and I failed at it. Opponent scored on turn 16. Another draw, another victory that slips away… Look at the setup, please, and tell me how it should be done. I really have trouble with my offense...

    I probably played it wrong (used to score as Woodies), but what I did is send my Guard to the left, and blitzed the unit close to the side line, hoping to push it inward and form a screen there. Problem is, with MA 6, the screen didn't get very far, and it was damn close to the sideline. I did ok for a turn or two, as my opponent is quite slow, but eventually I was overwhelmed. I couldn't break his defense at the top of my screen, but was eventually able to punch a hole in the wall, and slipped through with 2 girls and the ball carrier. Opponent then got lucky, dodged (with AG2) and blitzed the carrier, who got stunned. Still I thought I could fix this, but failed a dodge with my AG4 girl. That turnover was the beginning of the end. On my last turn, I managed to put 2 tackle zones on the carrier to stop a TD. Opponent rolled pushes, but one had Stand Firm, and carrier had to dodge out to score. With AG 2 and unskilled, he obviously succeeded where I failed with a skill and AG 4. :(

    Maybe I didn't play bad, and opponent got super lucky. But still, I wish I could have a better offensive plan. Advancing slowly with a cage against 4 Mummies (one with ST 6) and a ST 4 Thro-Ra seemed very wrong, but maybe it was the thing to do? Or just stall with a strong screen on my side of the field, and be happy to win 1-0?
     

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    Last edited: Jul 24, 2020
  10. Ravers

    Ravers Well-Known Member

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    As far as I can see you have 1 guard. Playing vs Khemri with a slow Str 3 team is going to be horrible when they have 3 Str 5 and a Str 6 (and 1 Str 4). Get more guard and it should become easier. The 1 guard you do have I would want more central to maximise options.
    On a side note dodge on a TG before Block??
     
  11. patbou73

    patbou73 Active Member

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    Thanks, but that doesn’t help my strategy in the matchup I’ve been dealt with. Obviously, with 300k spread in rating, I lack the Guards I would normally have at higher levels.

    What do you mean? That the mummy had Dodge instead of Block? Or that I should have dodge before blocking?

    Talking about the mummies... was it right to just ignore them? I figured that it would use to many ressources to get a 2D block on any on the LoS, and that it was better to put more girls on the screen. But thinking about it, maybe I should have maneuver a punch on the leftmost mummy, and put a tackle zone on it with a Blodger, just to keep it busy and away from the screen...
     
  12. BallztotheWalla

    BallztotheWalla Active Member

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    Forgot the f should of course have been alt+f4 to Close blood bowl
     
  13. Ravers

    Ravers Well-Known Member

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    It sounds like you played well and were unlucky to lose. Given the disparity in team values and skills I'd be happy with that. If I was the Khem coach I would be annoyed not to win with the teams as per the screenshot. Also your opponent has a very decent record according to Spikebot.

    re the Tomb Guardians, with Str 3 I would either ignore them/mark them with fodder/attempt to screen them off depending on the situation at the time. Committing 4 or more players to get a 2d vs AV9 is generally a waste of time.

    Oh and I meant it is very unusual to take dodge as a skill on a TG before block. Dwarfs etc will happily uphill block TGs all day long and dodge does not help that much. Also makes blocks from the dodge TG a lot riskier.
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2020
  14. tys123

    tys123 Courier Staff

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    I would have gone for the quick score down the left.
    Move the guard so he is next to the ST4 , TG and skelly , blitz the skelly and mark the hopefully downed skelly and the other skelly on that side so they can't reposition , block down the left most TG , mark the next 2 TG's with players you don't mind losing. Then you should hopefully be able to get down the left wing with the ball before anyone can get over there to block you off. If you don't stop the TG's on the left moving they will be able to block you in.
     
  15. patbou73

    patbou73 Active Member

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    Third attempt with the Amazons. As the other 2 times before, I rolled an AG4 Linegirl. What's the best way to use her on offense? Should I just send her to grab the ball (97% with RR) and carry it inside the cage to the endzone? Or should she grab and quick pass the ball to a Catcher (90% with RR), and thus move the ball forward more aggressively? I know the ball game should generally be avoided, but I'm very tempted by the +1 SPP I can probably farm on her... She wants Block as much as I do.
     
  16. Gallows Bait

    Gallows Bait Super Moderator Moderator

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    Remember if you're passing that you roll both the pass (2+ in this case, no RR) and the catch (3+ with RR), so your actual chance it of completing a pass like that is about 74%, more if you use a team reroll for the pass action.

    Only a hand off works on just the catch roll and that won't earn SPP.
     
  17. patbou73

    patbou73 Active Member

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    You are right. Odds of successfully pick up, make a quick pass and catch the ball are 82% with RR (62% without). This is recipe to burn precious rerolls and suffer turnovers. No wonder I wasn't as successful with the girls as they're supposed to be. :(
     
  18. Gallows Bait

    Gallows Bait Super Moderator Moderator

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    It's a flaw in AG3 team coaches, we're optimists. I'm terrible for expecting passing plays out of my humans just because they are way more fun and the rewards are higher, but ultimately rolling as few dice as possible is still always better.
     
  19. danton

    danton Well-Known Member

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    If the kick is deep enough against a team that can’t threaten the ball it’s often worth trying the spp pass at the end of the turn and just letting it fail without using the team rr if that happens.
     
  20. tys123

    tys123 Courier Staff

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    With AG3 teams you should only move the ball to another player if it gives you a clear advantage and has minimal risk if it fails.
    So the AG4 linegirl should pick the ball up and ideally carry it all the way to the endzone.
    Throw the pass with her on turn 8/16 kick off or in your backfield if playing against teams that can't take advantage of a dropped catch.

    In CCL you shouldn't have any catchers as they are not worth it.
    In league play you take them as they get sidestep and diving tackle on normal rolls ( after block ).
    The catch skill on the catchers only get used in an emergency and when you need to hand off the ball the catcher may be in the wrong place anyway so you end up handing off to someone without catch.