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Skaven Gutter Runner build

Discussion in 'League and Team Development Tactics' started by Gus Gus, Feb 16, 2010.

  1. Gus Gus

    Gus Gus New Member

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    Hi y'all. Was discussing this on my Intro thread but decided here is the better place for it.

    Am looking at ideal builds for Gutter Runners. I used to play 2 and had them geared towards 1-turn TDs.

    Want to break away from that and avoid being a one trick pony. I now run 4 and I'd like to surprise an opponent who thinks "oh wow, the big scary gutter runner's coming after me, oh mummy help me please" and then see his face when "big scary Gutter Runner" actually turns out to be the biggest thorn in his side all match!

    I was thinking of decent skill sets and thinking
    Wrestle, Side Step, Leap as almost definite ones.

    Others in consideration are Shadowing, Diving Tackle, Strip Ball plus misc mutations.

    Any advice gladly accepted :)
     
  2. VoidSeer

    VoidSeer Member

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    I don't play Skav, but I like the old wrestle, dauntless, horn build. It makes a very nice safety
     
  3. Thanatos

    Thanatos Member

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    Well there are multiple effective builds for the Gutter Runners (my favourite player in the game).

    Of those I play with I tend to build one as a 1-turn TDer, one as a Blitzer, one as a ball extracter and the last is whatever.

    1-turn TDer: Sprint, Sure Feet & +1 Mv
    Blitzer: Block/Wrestle, Horns/Dauntless, Tackle & Strip Ball
    Ball Extracter (i.e. You have somehow knocked the ball carrier over inside a cage & now there are 15 tackle zones on the ball): Sure Hands, Big Hand, (Two Heads/Leap+Long Legs)
    Plus whatever else as desired, perhaps a Pass Blocker (VLLegs,Pass BLock, Catch&+1AG has you intercepting on a 3+ with a RR)

    I would never build all 4 in the same path as that becomes just as boring as have four 1-turn TDers.

    "dauntless, horn build" Do those skill stack? I was sure that you get the +1 from Horns before you roll Dauntless thus making the combo less optimal.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2010
  4. VoidSeer

    VoidSeer Member

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    96
    You make your daunless roll before using horn; the two skills do stack
     
  5. Marlow

    Marlow Member

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    56
    LRB 4 Rules was the last time they stacked.

    What sort of League are you playing in and how many games do you expect to play? The longer you have to develop your runners the better they can become.

    Having a defensive runner with Block, Side Step, Shadowing and Diving Tackle is wonderful however that would take about 17 Touchdowns. Assuming you are spreading Touchdowns as evenly as you can among Runners you are probably looking at least a dozen games, more if you are not winning.

    As it is relatively easy to get to two skills (16 SPP's) I think it is best to work out which skills will be of most use against your opponents first. For instance Leap is great for cage breaking, but if your opponents never cage it will only help you with scoring.
     
  6. Candlejack

    Candlejack New Member

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    dauntless roll before horns was lrb 4.. since lrb 5 you get the horns bonus before dauntless thus making the dauntless roll easier..
     
  7. Coach

    Coach Administrator Head Coach

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    Dauntless and Horns don't stack any more in the same way, I did put that in the Gutter Runner guide...

    I think first off you want to protect them as they take a lot of heat, so Block or Wrestle as the first skill and then Side Step is super awesome as the second. Then I would look to specialise from there unless you rolled doubles in the mean time.

    Just having Block/Wrestle and Side Step though makes them even better players. You can attract blitzes, hold up players, force dodges, stall cages, occupy multiple opponents. I do the same with Human Catchers as well, tried, tested and works a charm.
     
  8. Marlow

    Marlow Member

    Messages:
    56
    Block/Wrestle and Side Step is a good route to follow.
    Personally I would give one of them Leap as a second skill to aid in cage breaking.
     
  9. Gus Gus

    Gus Gus New Member

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    Location:
    South, UK
    A lotta food for thought there. Thanks guys!

    I liking the idea of getting them all Side Step as a second skill and alternate Block and Wrestle as their first.

    The Block and Side Step Runners can then be given defensive skills to help them stall and force errors if possible.

    Would Tackle be a handy skill to add? Wrestle and Tackle would almost guarantee the ball carrier is going down half the time but it's another skill and their may be better ones? Thoughts?

    I do like Leap on my Runners since that skill saved two of my Runners' lives (funny story which I can relate later) and it helps to get in or out of cages.

    At the moment I am on the PC in single player - no-one really plays on the board any more. Pass Block I don't think will be much use until I join my friends' online league as I don't think I've ever seen the AI player pass the ball.

    (as a side question can I take my single player campaign team online or do I need to build a new one once I go online?)

    Shadowing and/or Diving Tackle would be good on at least one Runner... obvious question probably but if my Runner has both skills and fails one can I try the other?

    As for how quickly I can get these skills, so far my recent track record says never! :) Played two games vs. Lizardmen and lost both 2-0, 2 players dead and two seriously hurt... not a good run!:)
    I have got a Linerat with Block now though so that's something:rolleyes:

    EDIT: out of interest - on a double for a Runner's first or second skill - what's the general concensus for the best skill to take? Probably a mutation but there might be better ideas.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2010
  10. Coach

    Coach Administrator Head Coach

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    Linerat doubles are either Dodge or Guard, both are more useful than the mutations for them.

    As for Shadowing and Diving Tackle, the opponent attempts to dodge away. You can choose to use Diving Tackle if it makes any difference. If Diving Tackle won't work, then don't use it and make the opponent roll for Shadowing instead. If you used Diving Tackle on the dodge and then they rerolled it and succeeded (Diving Tackle applies to the reroll as well) then you can't use Shadowing as your player is now prone.

    Think you need to make a new team to play online, though I prefer stuntyleeg.com over the Cyanide game. Tackle does indeed combine with Wrestle if you get that far.
     
  11. Gus Gus

    Gus Gus New Member

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    Location:
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    Cool, cheers Coach.

    I assume that Tackle and Diving Tackle stack? Or would that be a little bit overkill?

    Also is there a call for Prehensile Tail as a mutation (on any form of Rat - not just Runners now) or is it kind of a waste for a double? Thought about a tackle monster linerat with Block, Tackle, Diving Tackle and Shadowing... kind of one trick but try and get away from the bugger :D
     
  12. Coach

    Coach Administrator Head Coach

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    All skills stack up now, though Tackle and Diving Tackle always have done (well since Diving Tackle was changed).

    Prehensile Tail is a waste of a double as well as you worked out, I probably wouldn't even take it as a normal skill either. It is handy to have with Diving Tackle and Tackle but there are other skills which will be more useful more often
     
  13. Marlow

    Marlow Member

    Messages:
    56
    That is the main problem with Mutations they waste a double roll. It would have been nice if at least one player on Skaven got them as a normal skill. Claws is probably the best choice for a Line Rat if you do not want Guard.

    I think extra arms is the overall best mutation to take on a Gunner Runner. Two Heads is also useful. Big Hand is nice but quite situational.
     
  14. RedDevilCG

    RedDevilCG Member

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    61
    I have a wrestle, tackle, dauntless, 2 heads gutter runner that is a ball carriers nightmare.

    I would take guard on a linerat doubles personally. I don't think you can ever really go wrong with guard. I've even seen guard on Gutter Runners put to good use before.
     
  15. Thanatos

    Thanatos Member

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    You can export your sp team to play a one off game online but you can't take them into an online league for example.