1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Skill allocation advice II

Discussion in 'League and Team Development Tactics' started by Nikolai II, Aug 8, 2013.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. 20phoenix

    20phoenix Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,222
    Location:
    Cardiff (GMT+1)
    Cyanide Username:
    20phoenix
    Country Flag:
    Went with leap on the gutter in the end after crunching some typical one turner numbers. Made the assumption that weather was standard, the kick was short, the gutter only gets pushed one square, the opposition are not tackle heavy and the gutter is not marked when receiving the catch.

    Was surprised to find that sure feet only improves the whole move by about 3% (45.4% from 42%) but leap is about 12% better (54.3%). I guess is this is because it removes the highest roll needed from the equation - the 4+ dodge. I also tested to see what happens if I rolled a double next skill and took 2 heads on the sure feet build or VLL on the leap build. Two heads makes it a 59.8% chance so has a massive impact but the VLL/leap combo still edges it with 61.7%.
     
  2. Dionysian

    Dionysian Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,025
    Location:
    Caerdydd
    Country Flag:
    What 4+ dodge? You should be able to one turn with dodges at a max of 3+ on a gutter.
     
  3. Squall

    Squall Member

    Messages:
    577
    Country Flag:
    If they have 11 players then you need a 4+ 3+ 2+ dodges
     
  4. 20phoenix

    20phoenix Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,222
    Location:
    Cardiff (GMT+1)
    Cyanide Username:
    20phoenix
    Country Flag:
    If your opponent lays out the most common defence - 8 men across the back and three on the LOS your first dodge will be into two tackle zones.
     
  5. Viajero

    Viajero Active Member

    Messages:
    2,995
    Location:
    Copenhagen
    Country Flag:
    Yeah, using samba I get:

    Base case (no sure feet, no leap):

    Catch 2+ - Dodge 4+ with dodge skill - Dodge 3+ with dodge skill - Dodge 2+ with dodge skill - Go For It 2+ - Go For It 2+
    32.15 %
    53.137 % with Team RR

    With sure feet:

    Catch 2+ - Dodge 4+ with dodge skill - Dodge 3+ with dodge skill - Dodge 2+ with dodge skill - Go For It 2+ with sure feet - Go For It 2+ with sure feet
    42.867 %
    57.454 % with Team RR

    With leap:

    Catch 2+ - Leap 3+ - Dodge 2+ with dodge skill - Go For It 2+ - Go For It 2+
    37.509 %
    68.766 % with Team RR

    So, as long as you make sure you save that last RR for the 1 turner attempt, Leap is better than Sure Feet for this scenario by around 11 percentage points.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2014
  6. mrpier

    mrpier Member

    Messages:
    77
    How does running in OTT compare with TTM attempts? I have a strong suspicion running it in has a considerably higher chance of success, is this correct? What are the best skills for TTM, on let's say the troll-goblin combo (relevant for my orcs).
     
  7. Viajero

    Viajero Active Member

    Messages:
    2,995
    Location:
    Copenhagen
    Country Flag:
    Well, a gobbo TTM with a roster Troll (I.e. Ripper would vary) would be something like this:

    Catch 3+ - other player - Really Stupid 2+ loner - Always Hungry 2+ loner - Throw 3+ loner - other player - Landing 4+ - Go For It 2+
    12.86 %
    30.007 % with Team RR

    This sequence does not include the pick up and hand off previous to the gobbo catch, for comparative purposes with the above. Unless skaven use another GR to pick up and hand off, the comparison may be fair. It also assumes no Pro or Strong Arm skill in the Troll and that the landing is within 1 GFI range of TD.

    Troll with Pro:

    Catch 3+ - other player - Really Stupid 2+ loner - Always Hungry 2+ loner - Throw 3+ loner - other player - Action 4+ - Go For It 2+
    17.608 %
    32.31 %

    Troll with Strong Arm:

    Catch 3+ - other player - Really Stupid 2+ loner - Always Hungry 2+ Throw with Strong Arm 2+ loner - other player - Landing 4+ - Go For It 2+
    16.075 %
    36.169 % with Team RR

    Troll with Pro and Strong Arm:

    Catch 3+ - other player - Really Stupid 2+ loner - Always Hungry 2+ loner - Throw 2+ loner - other player - Landing 4+ - Go For It 2+
    20.438 %
    38.229 %

    With Ripper instead:

    Catch 3+ - other player - Throw 3+ loner - other player - Landing 4+ - Go For It 2+
    18.519 %
    40.123 % with Team RR

    Flings with Treemen have it somewhat more easy to throw. Flings MA5 is more of a problem to get to TD so I have assumed the 2 GFI are needed:

    Catch 3+ - Throw (Trees have Strong Arm and no Loner) 2+ - Landing 4+ - Go For It 2+ - Go For It 2+
    19.29 %
    45.01 %
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2014
  8. mrpier

    mrpier Member

    Messages:
    77
    Thanks Viajero, much appreciated.
     
  9. Everblue

    Everblue Active Member

    Messages:
    1,033
    Country Flag:
    The skaven pick up would either be 3+ with sure hands or 2+, though. Whereas with gobbos that might not be the case!

    Otherwise relevant skills would be strong arm or pro on the troll (or lack of always hungry and really stupid if using ripper), and then catch and sure feet on the gobbo.

    EDIT - And the throw is 3+ I believe, not 2+, unless the troll has strong arm.
     
  10. Viajero

    Viajero Active Member

    Messages:
    2,995
    Location:
    Copenhagen
    Country Flag:
    True, corrected!
     
  11. Viajero

    Viajero Active Member

    Messages:
    2,995
    Location:
    Copenhagen
    Country Flag:
    Now also updated with the different pro/Strong Arm combinations, plus Ripper and flings Treemen.

    :D
     
  12. asprice81

    asprice81 New Member

    Messages:
    1
    Country Flag:
    I play Khemri in the Orca-Cola Championship and I have a Thro-Ra with block and dodge with 1 SPP to go before leveling up. When it comes time to give him a new skill, what should it be? Thanks!
     
  13. DerGnom

    DerGnom Member

    Messages:
    84
    Location:
    Southern Germany; GMT +2
    Cyanide Username:
    DerGnom
    Country Flag:
    Depending on the rest of your team, his role on the field and your prefered play style, one could think of tackle, fend, kick-off return or leader, for example.
     
  14. Nikolai II

    Nikolai II Super Moderator Moderator

    Messages:
    12,210
    Steam Username:
    Dreamy
    Cyanide Username:
    Dreamy
    Country Flag:
    Gnom has the full list, except AG, ST, MV or.. hmm.. maybe guard on a double. Makes him easier to block clear on a cage collapse.
    Else MB on a double, especially if you intend to take tackle on a single.
     
  15. hecubus

    hecubus New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Cyanide Username:
    hecubus15
    Country Flag:
    Hello, all! I'm currently playing a Dark Elf team in our league. Next week will be the first game of the playoffs.

    I have a Witch Elf who suffered a Serious Concussion and is now AV6, but she's also now at 4SPP and if I can swing it she'll be promoted after the next game. I'm trying to decide whether to go the Block or Wrestle route with her. I have a 2nd WE on the team with no SPP yet, but my plan is to develop one along the Wrestle path for attacking ball-carriers, and the other with Block for hitting and crowd-pushing.

    My initial thought was to take Wrestle for the AV6 WE since it avoids armor rolls. However, it will leave her prone and open to fouls, and while Block won't help in taking down opponents who also have Block, it will help her stay on her feet. Now I'm thinking I should use Block on her, and follow up with Side Step and other things that can help keep her safe. With any luck I can tack on Juggernaut down the line to help with Both Down rolls against targets with block.

    Does this seem like sound reasoning? Any thoughts?
     
  16. danton

    danton Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,766
    Location:
    Buenos Aires (gmt -3)
    Cyanide Username:
    danton
    Country Flag:
    There is little point in planning out a career path for a level 1 witch elf with Av 6! The best thing you can do is to fire her now, before she gets any more spp! ;)

    Other than that I do like to build one witch with Wrestle and one with Block. On either of them take MB as the first double though, as you will get more use out of that than Juggs in my experience.
     
  17. hecubus

    hecubus New Member

    Messages:
    21
    Cyanide Username:
    hecubus15
    Country Flag:
    I had intended to fire her after the injury, but money has been tight and I've had a handful of deaths among the linemen, I've had trouble even fielding 11 non-journeyman players some weeks. I did not have the money to even replace her with a lineman at first, then last game she mauled a couple Snotlings and picked up her SPP. I've also had bad luck with SPP generation (MVP's going to journeymen or dead people) so at this point I figure I should just stick with her.
     
  18. TravelScrabble

    TravelScrabble Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,603
    Location:
    Montreal, Canada (UTC -4)
    Steam Username:
    travelscrabble
    Cyanide Username:
    travelscrabble
    Country Flag:
    AV 6 makes her too fragile, if you need to keep her make sure you concentrat spps on the other one and replace when you can afford it. With elves it often good to run with less than 11 players, using journeymen to take LOS hits, till you get enpough of a bank to buy yourself up to 12.
     
  19. Mikko

    Mikko Active Member

    Messages:
    835
    Location:
    Turku,Finland UTC+2 (+3 with DST)
    Cyanide Username:
    Mikko
    Country Flag:
    [​IMG]

    Hi, Charon the Boatman rolled a normal skill and i´m a bit undecided what to pick for him. I was thinking about stand firm, grab, tackle too since i have only 2 tacklers and i´m facing lizards and amazons next.

    So, any suggestions...other than sack that fool :p.
     
  20. Nikolai II

    Nikolai II Super Moderator Moderator

    Messages:
    12,210
    Steam Username:
    Dreamy
    Cyanide Username:
    Dreamy
    Country Flag:
    Stand Firm is another of those skills that pay off more the more you get. But Guard / Tackle / MB is a solid skillset. Tackle is the more aggressive pick, while SF is more about spoiling.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.