1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Tactics Skill allocation advice III

Discussion in 'League and Team Development Tactics' started by Nikolai II, Jun 28, 2014.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. NieA7

    NieA7 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,078
    Steam Username:
    NieA7
    Cyanide Username:
    Under7
    Country Flag:
    Can't go wrong with kick off return, really helps against fast sides or when you've only got a turn or two to score. With guard I'd probably go for fend on that second thrower, helps keep him mobile so you can get the assists where you need them.
     
  2. Nikolai II

    Nikolai II Super Moderator Moderator

    Messages:
    12,210
    Steam Username:
    Dreamy
    Cyanide Username:
    Dreamy
    Country Flag:
    Nerves of Steel could be a nice way to get the ball out if you are marked. Dump-Off if you don't expect to protect your carrier from sacking very often.

    Dodge on doubles on the guard one, else kick as a defensive thrower?
     
  3. r3dknight

    r3dknight Member

    Messages:
    77
    Country Flag:
    Dump Off does seem interesting as a failsafe. But you do it before block dice is even thrown, no? Kinda not like it. NoS on the mean time meant I can afford to let them try a 2GFI to touch me and I still have my +2 bonus on pass to count on.

    As for Guard thrower - I already have a kicker tho...
     
  4. mrt1212

    mrt1212 Member

    Messages:
    207
    Country Flag:
    There aren't many situations where NOS as a passer is going to be utilized. NOS gets you a 2+ Pass which requires a 3+ Catch. Better hope you're throwing to a catcher otherwise a 3+ dodge w/ reroll is better.

    Basically NOS and Dump-Off are skills you take if you cant maintain your position or protection and it's only a handful of times you think "Thank nuffle I had this NOS thrower or Dump Off thrower"

    Think about other skills for positioning on defense or preventing an unfavorable fate at the hands of clawpomb, fend perhaps. Kick off return is also nice as it can help against Kick skill to some degree and against Blitz!. Are you sitting him on defense? Is that the best use of him?
     
  5. akirilus

    akirilus Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,459
    Country Flag:
    I don't have much experience playing as Humans, but I am having a hard time imagining a situation where I would say to myself "gosh, I am so glad my thrower with +2 to all pass attempts has NoS". Perhaps that's due to my lack of imagination :) . I think Kick Off Return is a strong candidate on a normal roll, for reasons of mitigating the effects of Kick and Blitz! Otherwise, I'd even consider giving him Leader, or Tackle if he is playing safety on defense. Honestly, he has the basics covered, everything else is either a special roll (+Agi or Dodge would be awesome) or of marginal effectiveness. KoR is nice, but ideally you are not receiving more than 2 kickoffs per game, and if you are, you're probably in trouble. Tackle is nice, but if your star Thrower is playing safety, you are either short on manpower or had a bad turnover. Dump Off is a very situational skill that to me just doesn't work with Agi 3 teams.
     
  6. tys123

    tys123 Courier Staff

    Messages:
    3,397
    Country Flag:
    Dump off is less useful with AG3 as it is less likely to be complete. Usually a 4+ pass ( 2TZ ) and 4+ catch ( 1TZ ). However it is better than nothing and even if the pass is dropped it will end up in a TZ.
    Kick of return is probably the best option on a normal roll.
     
  7. cptbeefalo

    cptbeefalo New Member

    Messages:
    22
    Country Flag:
    Hrmm. Am I crazy to consider taking +AG over Dodge as a second skill on a Pro Elf Blitzer (Block/SS/Guard)?
    Guy already doubled his first roll, and Guard makes him a target worth protecting. I already have one AG5 lineman, and a Thrower with Strong Arm. But... AG5 makes things so ridiculously easy, isn't it worth the risk to leave my Guard exposed a while longer?
     
  8. lawastooshort

    lawastooshort Member

    Messages:
    270
    Cyanide Username:
    lawastooshort
    Country Flag:
    Mu non-UKBBL underworld Thrower rolled a double for his second skill (first was Block).

    Dodge, or ignore the double and take Extra Arms?

    (my other thrower has just Block so far)
     
  9. jounisii

    jounisii Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,255
    Location:
    Turku, Finland
    Cyanide Username:
    jounisii
    Country Flag:
    Just take the AG. Feed him some TDs to get the protective dodge quickly. And then take leap. With another leaper you can start to leap cage bust often with 2d and that's when the fun starts. Uuuuh, makes my juices going just thinking about it ;)
     
  10. jounisii

    jounisii Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,255
    Location:
    Turku, Finland
    Cyanide Username:
    jounisii
    Country Flag:
    I'm no UW expert but dodge or guard would be my choices.
     
  11. Borke

    Borke Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,329
    Location:
    Hamburg
    Cyanide Username:
    Borke
    Country Flag:
    Dodge is awesome on a Thrower, as they are more runners than throwers anyway. Follow that with Two Heads (unless you get +AG), and your opponents will curse him.
     
  12. Nikolai II

    Nikolai II Super Moderator Moderator

    Messages:
    12,210
    Steam Username:
    Dreamy
    Cyanide Username:
    Dreamy
    Country Flag:
    Underworld thrower with block rolls doubles?

    Mighty blow, of course. Claw next. Underworld play like funny Norse, depitch or be depitched. :D
     
  13. Borke

    Borke Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,329
    Location:
    Hamburg
    Cyanide Username:
    Borke
    Country Flag:
    Alright, Dreamy's suggestion is certainly an option as well. And it's much better to turn your Thrower into a Pseudo-Blitzer if you get the MB early, as well.

    I still think that Dodge is a very strong option, though.
     
  14. danton

    danton Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,765
    Location:
    Buenos Aires (gmt -3)
    Cyanide Username:
    danton
    Country Flag:
    My OFL Gutter Runner hit level 5 and rolled his third +Ag increase! Of course he can't take it... :(

    So, currently he has Wrestle and Ag 6.

    My other GRs are:

    Wrestle, Horns & Tackle
    Block, SS & DT
    Rookie

    I think there are three main builds I could go with for the Ag 6 gutter:

    1. Sacker with Dauntless and Strip Ball
    2. Pass Defender with Catch and Pass Block
    3. One Turner with SS and Sure Feet

    I'm not really tempted by option 3.

    Option 1 looks nice, but I don't really want to be throwing my Ag 6 GR into cages if I can help it, so I'm not sure about that.

    Option 2 is nice to have, but won't have much value in some games. Even so I think it's the route I might go. Catch is the sort of skill that no one likes to take on a piece that doesn't start with it, but it can be good in a number of scenarios. It makes this GR more of a scoring threat in general and helps with one turners. Obviously when paired with Pass Block that means 3+ interceptions with rr. There was a GR in the OCC which had this build, but with Ag 5 and extra arms and he holds the record for the most interceptions in the league by far.

    Thoughts? Does anyone want to talk me out of it? :p
     
  15. TravelScrabble

    TravelScrabble Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,600
    Location:
    Montreal, Canada (UTC -4)
    Steam Username:
    travelscrabble
    Cyanide Username:
    travelscrabble
    Country Flag:
    Crazy as it sounds I think you might be onto something. I've been having a torrid time stopping 2 turners against me this season with both Slann and Skaven, trouble is that gutter markers give away easy 2d blitzes to get away that way (that and 30% TDs for opponents have been more like 100% - Nuffle paying me back for Rem and J failing to score on GFIs).

    Anyway the point is that my opponents have been passing against me quite a lot as I can't quite manage the 8 turn stall a lot of the time. With this gutter you can seriously hamper their passing lane.
     
  16. lawastooshort

    lawastooshort Member

    Messages:
    270
    Cyanide Username:
    lawastooshort
    Country Flag:
    Crikey. While Dodge seems the sensible choice, Mighty Blow seems like the awesome choice that I wish I'd thought of.

    With AG3 I don't really like to dodge anyway if I can't help it, and if I can't help it I hopefully have a reroll, so Dodge would only really be defensive, which pushes me even more towards the awesome choice. I've got until Sunday to decide. It's only 4 games in but I am already the league's most violent side. This would be my 5th Mighty Blow (TV 1400). Hmm.

    Probably thanks for being awesome, Dreamy :)
     
  17. Nikolai II

    Nikolai II Super Moderator Moderator

    Messages:
    12,210
    Steam Username:
    Dreamy
    Cyanide Username:
    Dreamy
    Country Flag:
    My underworld thrower rolled a double as his first skill, so he got MB right away, then claw, and is now working towards block or tackle or something (piling on?)

    Awesome (stupid) is getting a goblin clawPOMBer :D
    (I'm not even close, it's just awesome though ;))
     
  18. danton

    danton Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,765
    Location:
    Buenos Aires (gmt -3)
    Cyanide Username:
    danton
    Country Flag:
    Yeah, it's useful against bash teams if they need to score in 2 turns too, as you can make that a lot more risky for them potentially. Also if my DT GR gets to 51 spp I might give him Pass Block too, as 2 Pass Blockers can cover the width of the field. Pass Block has decent synergy with DT, as just getting your marker next to the intended receiver can be huge.

    So, I'm thinking Pass Block now for the Ag 6 gr and then Catch later on if he makes it to 76 spp yeah?
     
  19. tys123

    tys123 Courier Staff

    Messages:
    3,397
    Country Flag:
    I'd definitely go for pass block before catch.
    I'd also hope for the double for VLL instead of catch.
     
  20. danton

    danton Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,765
    Location:
    Buenos Aires (gmt -3)
    Cyanide Username:
    danton
    Country Flag:
    2+ interceptions would be nice lol

    Extra Arms might be better than VLL though by then. I know that VLL has the added benefit of cancelling Safe Throw, but that's not a skill you see too often. Extra Arms makes the interception 2+ and also helps with picking up in a scrum and catching when marked by a bunch of players.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.