BC 2 All Star Final

[TravelScrabble]

Its Final Time!

BC2's Anti-Fur All Stars VS Chaotic All Stars

Congratulations to @Guinness and @Mark Teal our two finalists coaching the Anti-Furs and Chaos Pact respectively.

Tickets have been sent so accept and I'll get the game launched

@Street @doohickey @Ilgoth you all mentioned maybe being able to stream, it would be great if this game could be featured as a showcase of the strongest players in the league. I'm guessing next weekend might be the likeliest time.

Thanks to all the coaches who played for making this event happen. I have some ideas for how it can be even better next year

 

[Swuul]

What were the results of the semi-finals?

 

[sbr32]

What were the results of the semi-finals?

Guinness' Anti-Fur murdered my Elves. It was 3-1. It could have been worse because I had no Elves to play with, but it could have been much closer if I didn't make a couple of ridiculous mistakes. I was hoping Guiness would write up a match report so I could comment on it. I will do one today hopefully.

 

[Ravers]

Guinness' Anti-Fur murdered my Elves. It was 3-1. It could have been worse because I had no Elves to play with, but it could have been much closer if I didn't make a couple of ridiculous mistakes. I was hoping Guiness would write up a match report so I could comment on it. I will do one today hopefully.

I just finished watching the replay. Not sure what else you could have done to be honest, that Anti-Fur team is terrifying with 2 real killers and 2 AGI 4 players.

 

[Ilgoth]

Will try to watch this thread and possibility to stream.

 

[sbr32]

I just finished watching the replay. Not sure what else you could have done to be honest, that Anti-Fur team is terrifying with 2 real killers and 2 AGI 4 players.

I just watched the Statsgrabber replay.

With the first mistake I thought I made it turns out the entire idea behind the plan was wrong, even if I had done the action properly it wouldn't have accomplished what I wanted, so whatever.

The second and biggest was T11; 1-1 score I was on defense. I popped and grabbed the ball with some AG5 bs. For some incredibly stupid reason (though I want to blame the game ) I thought the guy who ended up with the ball couldn't throw a pass so he just stood there like an idiot in the middle of the field. I had a Blodge Woodie Line Elf marked by 1 Blodge Saurus downfield. With a 2+ Pass, 3+ Catch (still had a RR in hand for the turn), 97% Dodge I would be 3 squares from the end zone and he would have needed 2 GFIs to Blitz me; with 1 GFI by me he couldn't get a hit on me at all. That would have made it 2-1 me on my T12, giving Guinness only 4 turns to score. He probably would have because I didn't have any players left but who knows.

 

[Guinness]

@sbr32
Last league I was in there was this /epic/ turn around game where things kept going crazy, so I wrote about it, and despite trying to make my opponent look great, he was really annoyed. So here's my first attempt at a write-up for BC2!

------------------------------

This game started off right was when Jim introduced the game with, "I wonder if there are any future star players on these teams." I have to admit, I often feel like a miserable coach facing off against Elven teams because I dread the amazing lack of 1s I see rolled against me quite often. When the kickoff allowed a Defensive reposition the team assembled into a Red Razor murder line. Between the healthy mix of strength, guard, and stand firm, there was no place the elves could manage more than a 1D block. Taking the wise solution after their first KO, the Elves used their AG awesomeness to put 4 players behind the line, forcing the team to split up to deal with them. Pao de Acucar did what he did best, introduce the crowd to one of the opposing players for an autograph signing (which happened to be the only legitimate catcher that had crossed the line). Over the next 3 turns the Anti-Fur Alliance players proceeded to give up massive amounts of space and finally a Touchdown, in exchange for the near death Kurumu Kurono (the fastest Wardancer).

Despite both KOs waking up, the second quarter turned the game around drastically. Over the next few turns the Elves managed to liberate the ball every turn, even using a fire wizard, but their Pyotr (an upcoming AG5 Kislev Quarterback) showed his mettle and skill, retrieving it every round and getting it to safety. Unfortunately, this cost the elves dearly losing, 3, then 2, then 1 more to the sidelines. The Elves returned that with the willingness to wake up and give it another go, but 7-11 going into Halftime left them vulnerable...

The change in defensive positioning was not enough as the AFA formed over the ball, learning from their previous mistakes formed their cage much more defensively, but the Elves had similarly learned from their mistakes, taking a cheap shot and removing their greatest threat Jack Daniels II from the game early in the half. With some amazing agility plays, the elves managed to wrestle (literally) the ball from their opponents, but due to Cersei's greed, and unwillingness to riskily pass the ball to a potential receiver, the Elves lost their chance to take the lead, and Cersei was relegated to sleep off a much deserved punch to the face. Quickly following Pyotr (nearly falling for the tripwire on the chalk line trick) turned the score 2-1.

Overcome with shame, Jack and Cersei faked their sleep to stay on the sidelines to avoid playing for the final quarter of the game. Being outmanned 4-10 at their point, the AFA players isolated and abused any Elf close enough to be a threat of a touchdown. Their agility plays run out, the Elves were shown up on their throws and pick ups by the agile members of the AFA players. The last few turns were only enough for a single touchdown to be scored leaving the numbers at 3-1 for the AFA over the Elves. Both coaches played intensely during the last few turns that the end of the game buzzer was even a shock to them!

Moving into the finals, both teams look to be stocked with a solid lineup, which should make for some good ball-viewing!

 

[Guinness]

@Mark Teal
Hey, I'm around most days this week upcoming except Thursday and Saturday (to my knowledge). I'm in UTC-8, so if we can plan something reasonable for 18:00->04:00 UTC start time I'm sure I can fit it in. Just keep me posted.

 

[sbr32]

Perfect write up @Guinness

I felt my only chance was to stop the AFA drive in the first half, after I scored on my T5. I threw everything I had, Elves and Fireballs, at the AFA cages and was able to get the ball free almost every time but that AG5 Catcher and AG4 Catch Skink just weren't going to let their team lose. It all ended up being for naught once Guinness scored on T8 but I knew I could never stop him for an entire second half drive so I didn't feel I had much choice other than to stop a 4 turn score, let him score in the second half and hope to have enough players left for the 1 or 2 turn TD in return. Didn't happen.

Good luck against the bad guys next week Guinness!

 

[Street]

I have a suggestion if we do future versions of this competition to try and add some more balance to it.

Maybe add a max fieldable team strength (Based on players base strength, so having a bunch of +ST players on the team can get around the limit just like with real teams)

I would say making the max be the same that Khemri use, so 41. That way, teams could have 4 ST5 players, 3 ST5 & 2 ST4, 2 St5 & 4 ST4, 1 ST5 & 6 ST4 or 8 ST4 players, assuming the rest of the strongest first 11 players are all st3, obviously can have even more stronger players if the rest is filled out with ST2 or less players (Helps stunty teams we may see in future even more)

Obviously with this we could remove the only 2 big guys rule.

What do people think?

 

[Mark Teal]

@Mark Teal
Hey, I'm around most days this week upcoming except Thursday and Saturday (to my knowledge). I'm in UTC-8, so if we can plan something reasonable for 18:00->04:00 UTC start time I'm sure I can fit it in. Just keep me posted.

Hello, Friday or Sunday I can be free from 18.00-00.00utc, happy to fit around the day/time that suits you best of those, or if someone is planning a stream.

 

[TravelScrabble]

I have a suggestion if we do future versions of this competition to try and add some more balance to it.

Maybe add a max fieldable team strength (Based on players base strength, so having a bunch of +ST players on the team can get around the limit just like with real teams)

I would say making the max be the same that Khemri use, so 41. That way, teams could have 4 ST5 players, 3 ST5 & 2 ST4, 2 St5 & 4 ST4, 1 ST5 & 6 ST4 or 8 ST4 players, assuming the rest of the strongest first 11 players are all st3, obviously can have even more stronger players if the rest is filled out with ST2 or less players (Helps stunty teams we may see in future even more)

Obviously with this we could remove the only 2 big guys rule.

What do people think?

Nice idea Street Ill be putting up a thread for discussion soon and will add that to the op.

 

[doohickey]

If it fits my schedule I am definitely down to stream the final

 

[Guinness]

Re: Scheduling @Mark Teal
If there's no serious consideration for the streaming I'd prefer to play around 19:00-20:00 start time on Friday. If they really want a different time, I might be able to accommodate, but I'd rather play then. Note: I might be going home for the weekend now, still waiting on confirmation, but I'll keep you posted.

Re: ST limit on teams @TravelScrabble
I think it will help out some of the teams, but I'm unsure if I like the idea entirely. I did play this team with less ST than I could have, there could have been one more Saurus on the team, and I'd have to do the addition to check. I feel like when you're playing an "All-Star" format, the idea should be for fun, laughs, and avoid the whole "need for balance" thing, since it's more of just an exhibition. I really enjoyed these games because I felt like all the players on my team had personalities outside of the way I was leading them as their presiding coach. Edit: Just counted, the AFA team rings in at 43ST, and that's with 13 players, which seems quite reasonable, but it did feel a little overwhelming to the opponents (but considering I got the Defensive event, that really can skew how tough a line is to break through, and plus, neither of the other teams really had any amount of Guard to contend with the ST).

 

[Street]

@Guinness

Just to clarify, even with the ST restriction idea I had in play, I am sure you would have still easily beaten me.

I agree these are mostly for fun, though it is more fun for all parties involved if everyone has a chance for winning. I have the idea mostly to help the undead, elf and stunty teams, elves can only get a treeman, so any ruling is unlikely to help them, but limiting the max strength of the enemy teams means its harder for them to get boxed into a situation that is impossible for them to get out of even with AG4.

Undead team felt very limited with only 2 big guys and 2 ST4 pieces, since undead teams are hybrid other than Khemri, they work out with barely any more strength than the normal teams would but as much if not less agility than normal (Though these issues could be helped if they get vampires added to them in future). Stunty teams in the future clearly need more than 2 big guys, and even just an exception of 3 for them would feel a bit off when ogre teams obviously get 6. The only teams limited if we did this change or something similar, are the Lizard and company team and the chaos / nurgle team as they are the ones that get a lot of possible ST4 to work with.

It is just a suggestion anyway, don't have to go with it if people don't like it or can go for a different idea that tries to achieve the same goal.

 

[Mark Teal]

Re: Scheduling @Mark Teal
If there's no serious consideration for the streaming I'd prefer to play around 19:00-20:00 start time on Friday. If they really want a different time, I might be able to accommodate, but I'd rather play then. Note: I might be going home for the weekend now, still waiting on confirmation, but I'll keep you posted.

Re: ST limit on teams @TravelScrabble
I think it will help out some of the teams, but I'm unsure if I like the idea entirely. I did play this team with less ST than I could have, there could have been one more Saurus on the team, and I'd have to do the addition to check. I feel like when you're playing an "All-Star" format, the idea should be for fun, laughs, and avoid the whole "need for balance" thing, since it's more of just an exhibition. I really enjoyed these games because I felt like all the players on my team had personalities outside of the way I was leading them as their presiding coach. Edit: Just counted, the AFA team rings in at 43ST, and that's with 13 players, which seems quite reasonable, but it did feel a little overwhelming to the opponents (but considering I got the Defensive event, that really can skew how tough a line is to break through, and plus, neither of the other teams really had any amount of Guard to contend with the ST).

ok lets say 19.00 Friday then if nothing comes up.

 

[Ilgoth]

Friday 1900GMT+0 should be doable for me. @Street @doohickey - you guys wanna join the cast?

 

[Street]

Friday 1900GMT+0 should be doable for me. @Street @doohickey - you guys wanna join the cast?

Should be doable for me.

 

[Ravers]

@Guinness

Just to clarify, even with the ST restriction idea I had in play, I am sure you would have still easily beaten me.

I agree these are mostly for fun, though it is more fun for all parties involved if everyone has a chance for winning. I have the idea mostly to help the undead, elf and stunty teams, elves can only get a treeman, so any ruling is unlikely to help them, but limiting the max strength of the enemy teams means its harder for them to get boxed into a situation that is impossible for them to get out of even with AG4.

Undead team felt very limited with only 2 big guys and 2 ST4 pieces, since undead teams are hybrid other than Khemri, they work out with barely any more strength than the normal teams would but as much if not less agility than normal (Though these issues could be helped if they get vampires added to them in future). Stunty teams in the future clearly need more than 2 big guys, and even just an exception of 3 for them would feel a bit off when ogre teams obviously get 6. The only teams limited if we did this change or something similar, are the Lizard and company team and the chaos / nurgle team as they are the ones that get a lot of possible ST4 to work with.

It is just a suggestion anyway, don't have to go with it if people don't like it or can go for a different idea that tries to achieve the same goal.

I think balance kind of goes out the window with the mixed team format (not that BB is particularly balanced to start with!), which is probably the main reason I am not interested in the proposed mixed team league. This is then exacerbated by the ability to cherry pick players from existing teams, you could theoretically have a team of predominantly Agi 5 or 6 elves for example if there were enough players that had managed to skill up that way throughout the league. If you are limiting Str players I could argue that you should restrict Agi the same way, or only allow 1 MV 10 Gutter etc. (Not that I am, just playing devils advocate).

Oh and good luck to @Guinness in the final, don't get too attached to my Norse players as (Nuffle willing with injuries) you will be playing against them next season in Altdwarf!

 

[Street]

I think balance kind of goes out the window with the mixed team format (not that BB is particularly balanced to start with!), which is probably the main reason I am not interested in the proposed mixed team league. This is then exacerbated by the ability to cherry pick players from existing teams, you could theoretically have a team of predominantly Agi 5 or 6 elves for example if there were enough players that had managed to skill up that way throughout the league. If you are limiting Str players I could argue that you should restrict Agi the same way, or only allow 1 MV 10 Gutter etc. (Not that I am, just playing devils advocate).

That is why I said the ST limit should NOT, take into account +ST players, if you had 2ST5, 4ST4 players, then a bunch of ST3 players who all had +ST stats then thats fine under the suggestion I made.

I agree regardless balance is thrown out of the window a lot in this format, though bloodbowl isn't a perfectly balanced game anyway.